tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-993649290245605005.post5798354418468279531..comments2024-03-28T09:42:20.558-04:00Comments on Writers Who Kill: Who Reads What: Thrillers, Mysteries, and Gender LinesJim Jacksonhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/15090252530437277145noreply@blogger.comBlogger15125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-993649290245605005.post-51987239059175354172015-10-03T23:10:43.047-04:002015-10-03T23:10:43.047-04:00K.M., Wendy Wasserstein said it best, I think. Whe...K.M., Wendy Wasserstein said it best, I think. When she was a graduate student in the Yale drama program and first wrote and produced The Heidi Chronicles, a male grad student dismissed it with a superior air, saying, "I just can't identify with a woman character." Wasserstein stared him down and said, "Well, I've been identifying with male characters all my life, so I know it can be done. Try harder."Linda Rodriguezhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11913741596693442469noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-993649290245605005.post-52480416779223069972015-10-03T19:29:32.635-04:002015-10-03T19:29:32.635-04:00I find it frustrating that we try to shoehorn book...I find it frustrating that we try to shoehorn books into categories so completely. It is beneficial when a reader wants only a specific type of book (and can usually identify it just by looking at the cover) but I think most readers are open to new and different experiences, often books which defy neat categorizing.<br /><br />And I think the prejudices still exist among readers concerning the author's gender. I know men who won't read books by women. As recently as the Harry Potter phenomena, J.K. Rowling was advised to hide the fact that she was a female author for fear that boys would not read her books.KM Rockwoodhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03973749764907859829noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-993649290245605005.post-42788517510712216122015-10-03T18:41:26.935-04:002015-10-03T18:41:26.935-04:00Kara, yes, it was a ground-breaker.Kara, yes, it was a ground-breaker.Linda Rodriguezhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11913741596693442469noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-993649290245605005.post-57699863839420591362015-10-03T18:25:54.637-04:002015-10-03T18:25:54.637-04:00Fascinating, Linda. Eye of the Needle is one of my...Fascinating, Linda. Eye of the Needle is one of my favorite thrillers and I had no idea it was the first with a female main character. Kara Cerisehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16484336785514235707noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-993649290245605005.post-29552703919106856212015-10-03T17:56:41.122-04:002015-10-03T17:56:41.122-04:00Gloria, I suspect that your books actually fall mo...Gloria, I suspect that your books actually fall more in the traditional mystery field and less in the cozy, which is a subset of that. The cozy usually steers clear of edgier subject matter.<br /><br />Shari, I think you're absolutely right. The denigration of the male who reads and is educated has been going on in this country for a long time, beginning with Washington Irving's Legend of Sleepy Hollow and James Fenimore Cooper's books, but it's been exacerbated since the post-World War II period. I'd love to find a way to turn it around.Linda Rodriguezhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11913741596693442469noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-993649290245605005.post-58561789932677538932015-10-03T17:50:37.598-04:002015-10-03T17:50:37.598-04:00Warren, yes. I don't mind graphic violence tha...Warren, yes. I don't mind graphic violence that plays a necessary role in the book, but I must confess that some serial-killer thrillers where we're supposed to watch the killer rape, torture, and dismember in great detail totally turn me off. It feels voyeuristic.<br /><br />Margaret, I think you did the smart thing there. Genres matter more to agents and publishers than to readers, I think, but you have to get past the agents and publishers first.Linda Rodriguezhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11913741596693442469noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-993649290245605005.post-76162373704458422532015-10-03T17:45:35.661-04:002015-10-03T17:45:35.661-04:00Jim, I suspect your response and George's are ...Jim, I suspect your response and George's are related. through the years, in the U.S. at least, we've had a strong push in our popular media to denigrate the nice, smart, educated guy as a weakling and sissy and offer up the physical, often violent and cruel, tough guy with "street smarts" rather than any education for admiration.<br /><br />George, the switch-over in readership took place before women became prominent in publishing, so I don't think your theory holds water. I think the change in readership stats has a lot more to do with the push in popular media to portray males as admirable heroes who always resort immediately to physical violence rather than reason and to denigrate the reading, educated man, as I mentioned above. I this stereotype of masculinity that gets shoved in everyone's faces so much now leaves many boys and men unwilling to read.Linda Rodriguezhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11913741596693442469noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-993649290245605005.post-41786937649731230592015-10-03T17:28:48.726-04:002015-10-03T17:28:48.726-04:00Elaine, we all chafe at the restraints of genre ca...Elaine, we all chafe at the restraints of genre categories at times. I'm waiting for publishers to realize that the mingling of genres is part of the appeal of YA which has been so hot lately with readers of all ages. But publishing is usually slow on the uptake. Your critiquers who question your genre are right, in that it probably will make your book a much harder sale to an agent or an editor today. though it would fit right in if it were a YA novel where they're gender-bending constantly.Linda Rodriguezhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11913741596693442469noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-993649290245605005.post-27348476386056709812015-10-03T12:34:50.878-04:002015-10-03T12:34:50.878-04:00Linda, this is fascinating! And I am looking forwa...Linda, this is fascinating! And I am looking forward to seeing that serial killer cozy some day (I picture kitties with gore tipped knitting needles on the cover.)<br />One disturbing issue you touch on is this idea of genre and gender, and reading being seen as something that only women do. How did that happen? My own idea is the hyper marketing of virtually everything. Kids are shunted into pink or blue so early, and many boys do think of reading as a "girl" activity. Boys seem to get their story fixes through video games. Not healthy, and now we're seeing boys' educational attainment dropping. There are many good writers doing good work for children, but marketing will always try to reach their perceived audience for a book, and to do that they determine an audience for a book.Shari Randallhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16425493627354028820noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-993649290245605005.post-81867705949891411922015-10-03T10:58:38.444-04:002015-10-03T10:58:38.444-04:00My series are cozies dealing with social issues, l...My series are cozies dealing with social issues, like environmentalism, racism, gay bashing, drug abuse, etc. and alcoholism in my latest still waiting on a cover before I publish it.<br />In some ways they may be a little edgier than some cozies, but probably not a whole lot.<br />Actually, except for the small town aspect, I think my books are more in the traditional line<br />than the pure cozy.<br /> <br />Although I like reading suspense novels, I'm not into the serial killer type books or horror books, and it's not because I live alone with a dog too friendly to protect me, either. As <br />for paranormal books, ghosts are okay, but not vampires or zombies. Gloria Aldenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13581719606924364447noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-993649290245605005.post-47576961617592334702015-10-03T09:44:39.597-04:002015-10-03T09:44:39.597-04:00I originally wrote a cozy with a serial killer, bu...I originally wrote a cozy with a serial killer, but realized that too many agents and small publishers wouldn't touch it. So I made him a stalker and a one-time murderer in a traditional mystery. Marketing and finding an empty niche do matter.Margaret S. Hamiltonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07979191318652199350noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-993649290245605005.post-30403682695907114642015-10-03T09:26:57.165-04:002015-10-03T09:26:57.165-04:00Another category is cozy noir, which sounds like a...Another category is cozy noir, which sounds like an oxymoron. Reading tastes vary a great deal. Personally, I do not enjoy graphic depictions of violence.Warren Bullhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07789270258599769915noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-993649290245605005.post-63132984245033665902015-10-03T07:29:37.281-04:002015-10-03T07:29:37.281-04:00I have heard a shift has occurred in the SF arena ...I have heard a shift has occurred in the SF arena as well, more so in the fantasy area, that women read more than men. While I do not dispute there are more female readers than before, there is another factor that people do not recognize. Many if not most of the editors, at least in SF (because I know this one), are women. They state that men are not reading so they buy things that only women read. The net effect is that men will read less of what is available since it is not targeted for them, hence it is a self-fulfilling prophecy.George Koelschhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07959277380739149653noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-993649290245605005.post-10390277497674192302015-10-03T07:03:20.341-04:002015-10-03T07:03:20.341-04:00I’ve tried a little gender-bending myself. My prot...I’ve tried a little gender-bending myself. My protagonist, Seamus McCree, is a basically nice guy (divorced, but with a great son, Paddy, and an interesting mother) who abhors guns. His female sidekicks have had those chops when it comes to weapons and martial arts.<br /><br />It’s not an overpopulated niche, and that may be because people don't actually prefer to read about nice guys who solve mysteries with brains not brawn. But heck, everyone can’t be a trailblazer.<br /><br />~ Jim<br />Jim Jacksonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15090252530437277145noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-993649290245605005.post-62991840299515303822015-10-03T05:48:32.356-04:002015-10-03T05:48:32.356-04:00One of my peeves in the paranormal mystery subgenr...One of my peeves in the paranormal mystery subgenre is that, as you've stated, they lean toward urban fantasy, more hardcore crime featuring vampires and shapeshifters, involving violence. I love fantasy mystery, but I like mine on the lighter side. The EJ Cooperman, Deb Macomber, and Magnon Ballard style of cozy fanatsy. Each of these author's works feature ghosts and angels. I differentiate these works by naming them "supernatural" rather than paranormal, although I don't think if the industry does, lumping it all together as paranormal. <br /><br />One of my manuscripts includes angels and demons (for balance) and even though it isn't quite as fluffy as the authors' works I've named, to me it qualifies as supernatural but not quite a cozy. Some of my beta readers objected because the manuscript didn't qualify as any specific genre or subgenre. But I get sick of reading the same elements in every book. It is time for some fresh "out of the box" mysteries unconfined by conventions. <br /><br />As for the cozy serial killer series, as long as the focus is on the investigation and not on the grizzly details, I can envision such a book. Sort of a Jessica Fletcher nails the Boston Strangler. Thanks for the history lesson, Linda.E. B. Davishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16746747050278597888noreply@blogger.com